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The Beh

Voyageur
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About The Beh

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  • Biography
    I've been a hardcore team Canada fan since the qualifying round of the '94 world cup, attending almost every national team game held in Toronto. I made the trip across the Atlantic for the 2006 WC and looking forward to supporting the team in Brazil in 2014. Go Canada!
  • Location
    Toronto
  1. Honestly, reading the comments, I wonder if some people here have ever opened up an encyclopedia, or looked at a world atlas or Google Earth. There's absolutely no basis to object to a profesisonal tiered league system based on Canada's size. The US, Russia, China, Brazil and most importantly Australia are all countries with the exact same issue - ALL of them have a professional league system. So, to object to that based on Canada's size lacks any form of objectivity and is borderline ridiculous. Then there's objection that a CSL 2.0 won't be the EPL. Again, it's obvious no thought has gone into these types of objections. Was the EPL the EPL 100 years ago? Did any of the legaues in the countries I mentioned above start being perfect, high-standard leagues or have they all improved over time? Did all the teams have 40,000 fans pouring into the stadiums on the 1st day? Did they all start with world class talent? Did the investment interest exist in any of them prior to their football federations even expressing interest in a professional league? Honestly, all of these objections are no different than saying nothing can be done in any field or in any aspect of life becase there's going to be obstacles, or because you're simply not good enough, or because you're not good at it from the start so why even bother. It's no wonder we end up with an Insurance Salesman as the president of our soccer association and the King of Donair as our coach and $70 tickets and $15 beers to watch players making $40k a year when you can pay the same ticket price and $3-5 / beer to watch world class action with players making millions everywhere else, including at the World Cup! When you set the standards for your representatives low, and even go further to excuse why they shouldn't be doing anything at all, don't expect them to give you some extra-ordinary returns. Or if you do, at least don't complain about the result(s).
  2. Thanks Paul. There was still no info on costs though. Are they free? Did you pay for your MED?
  3. Mark my words guys, Canada won't be in the HEX, let alone the World Cup for as long as the CSA operates the way that it does and with the current league system (or lack thereof). Even if we started fixing the CSA and our soccer program in general, starting tomorrow, we'll be lucky to make it to the HEX for 2018 and to the WC for 2022 - that would be a half-realistic goal, considering positive change takes a very long time to trickle through the system. But with no change in sight and the fans not willing to say or do anything about it, look to 2016, the end of Victor's presidency as the potential date for the start of any positive change and 2026 as the best case scenario for Canada to be in the WC.
  4. I think you're right Paul. I finally got some answers from the people who are hosting the next coaching session and they asked me to register online to their club (which I think is free) - but they didn't offer to pay for fee! Anyway, it's $220 taxes in for the Soccer For Life course, but apparently there's no set cost. The nice gentleman also told me that I need to do complete the Making Ethical Decisions and Respect for Soccer courses to be certified to coach and told me those courses are available online through the OSA web site. Went back to the OSA web site and looked for a link or any information on how to register for those two courses, but to no avail. After half an hour I just gave up. Overall, I spent around 2 hours trying to find the information which should have been readily available through the OSA and I didn't get very far. In comparisson, in less than 15 minutes, I figured out all the steps, costs, and locations for all the FA coaching levels and courses all the way to the new UEFA Pro License, just by Googling.
  5. Just called the OSA. Told them that I'm interested in the LTPD and asked them how much it would cost to take the Soccer For Life (Community Coaching) course and approximately how much the total cost would be to get the National A license. They put me through to the person "in charge" of that area. This is the answers I got from the person in charge: what is that? is that on our web site? isn't the price on the web site? I have no idea about the cost of the SFL program, no idea about the total cost of the National A license program. Just started working here 2 days ago! I'll ask my manager to look into and put the prices on the web site. You should check back in a few months! No information on the CSA site about costs either. It tells you to contact the provincial asccoiation, which is what I did. And this is the level of dedication of our soccer association(s) to coach training and LTPD. Don't take my word for it, give it a try. At the very least it will establish in your mind how solid or broken this system is, if you're still on the fence.
  6. LOL. I've been making the argument that it is *not* working at *any* level throughout this thread and that it's NOT not working at ANY level for our mens' teams because there is no proper national league with a promotion/relegation system. So obviously the existence of a promotion/relegation system is NOT the reason that things aren't working! I fail to see the logic of zoning into one non-national U-15 girls' league which has a promotion/relegation system and proclaim that's the reason that things aren't working in this country in general. Frankly, it's a absurd to me and I don't think you need to be an ex-CMNT player or a coach of a youth team to develop some basic reasoning abilities. And when did Moyes criticize or talk about removing the promotion/relegation system in England?!!! He has consistently talked about "balance" between education and individual talent and not just giving coaches certificates, but enabling them to IMPLEMENT that education into the game (i.e. win), which is exactly what I said in my post that you're discagreeing with! From his latest interview... ""I see a lot of people getting their badges, which is good, but what I also see is a lack of imagination in the coaching. I see people stuck in the past, doing the same coaching and coming out with the same ideas. What I don't see enough of is coaches thinking, 'Now, how can I take it into practice? How can I test the players and task them more to take what we do in that practice into games?".
  7. Thanks for listening guys and it was worth a shot.
  8. What does that have to do with anything? Are you suggesting that coaching a youth volleyball or even soccer team in Ontario would somehow give me a unique perspective on the same soccer structure that is set up all over the world (with the exception two countries in N. America)? That if I was coaching a girls u-15 team, all of a sudden I'd be qualified to say let's not go with what has been working all over the world for the past 100 years and let's reinvent the wheel? Isn't that all we've been doing for the past 20 years in our men's program, rather than bringing in some expertise to show us how and why it's working elsewhere and how and why our continuos re-invention of the wheel yields no result? How's that going so far? Anyway, no point in arguing against 2+2 equals 5 in Canada.
  9. SO, I am not suggesting incorporating the Voyageurs (although that opinion was brought up) and adding complications to the simple, yet effective system that's working here, as you said. And I'm not talking about sending ONE representative to the CSA to talk about 1000 different types of opinions on he boar - as you correctly pointed out that would be more divicive than anything and pissing in the wind - and I would go as far as saying @ a 60° upward angle! Look, the way I think this is going to work is to start a single thread or have a separate sub-forum, where as many people as possible represent their case on what their vision is (or if they had a chance to speak to the CSA, what would they say). Then you short list the volunteers/candidates to maybe 6 people that represent the majority of the views on this forum, through a vote. You now have 6 representatives who live in Ottawa or are willing to make a trip, representing the most diverse range of constructive ideas on this forum, to request a meeting with Victor or the entire board and they go and present the collective opinions of the Voyageurs. Worst case scenario, they'll reject the meeting - nothing lost, but at least something was tried. And if you have some big names in those representatives, like JDV or ex CMNT players, I highly doubt the board will reject a 1/2 day meeting. And if they do, at least it shows the fans where the CSA stands and where they want to go from here - whether they want to give up, boycott the games, take their case to the media, etc. Like you said, we all have had that fantasy of making some positive change in Canadian soccer. Well, through some unexpected turn of events, you are now at this juncture where you can at least try and make that change - make that fantasy a reality, not just for yourself, but for thousands of despaired and humiliated fans who want something positive to hold-on to right now. Yes, as you said the interest on the forum is up for the past few days - that's always the case in every soccer/football forum after a game like this. But my experience is that hopelessness and helplessness are the fans' and forums' worst enemies. As the eastern expression goes, you have to stick the bread in the oven while the over is hot!
  10. Thanks for the article Paul. Like I said in the other thread Jason contradicts himself a lot and it's absolute rubbish what he's saying here. He proposes that "a competitive structure based on promotion and relegation forces coaches into playing to win, rather than playing to educate." What he fails to understand is that the ultimate purpose of that education is to win, so by not relegating the coaches that are not accomplishing both, you essentially instill the mentaility of "it's okay to be losers as long as you understood the game". But the real contradiction here is that you are not promoting the coach from the lowet division that is both educating his/her players and is teaching them how to implement it during the game (i.e. win). Having said that, I agree with him that 1/3 of any league being relegated is a little excessive and will may counter-productive.
  11. What better place to do it from my good sir? Who would be better to instill the vision and inspiration that is so lacking from our program, than people who are passionate about it, have been following it, believe in it and are putting their hearts and soul into every Canadian game? Who would be better than people who have already proven that they can turn their passion and belief into a positive and succeeful movement? Is movement not what we're lacking at the CSA? Is mobilization of the fans, not one of the most important responsiblities of a national association? As a collective, do you think the Voyageurs are any less qualified than any individual member on the CSA board, at least in having an opinion about our soccer program? Do you think the Voyageurs don't have business analysts, accountants, excutives and visionaries within their ranks that can provide a review of CSA's practices and provide some positive input? As to what we would say, that all depends on the collective. The only thing that needs to be established at this point IMHO is the fact that we can and should have something to say. The rest will work itself out. As El Hombre so wisely said in the other thread, it's good to be an optimist. Absolutely and I don't think any one of us are under the illusion that anything, even the least significant step is not going to take a lot of determination, hard work and a monumental effort. But, and at the expense of seriously butchering a cliche, isn't it better to have tried and lost, than to have never tried at all? Yes, it has been a simple and extremely effective philosophy and it has worked great. I don't think anyone is questioning that or suggesting that any other efforts should take away from the representation in the stadium. And judging by the posts here, I don't think there would be any lack of volunteers to help with anything that needs to be done, so that anything would be taken away from the primary objective. But as many of the people I talked to at the Duke pointed out, and I'm praphrasing here a bit, it's unimaginable the type of erosion in fan support that happens after an 8-1 loss. All those years of great work, wiped out in less than two hours. In that sense, I don't think some type of effort in maintaining and preserving that cultural influence is shifting focus away from that very simple and effective philosophy. Quite the contrary, I think it's a natural extension of it. LOL. And I think we're all in the same shoes and individually it hasn't been anything more than a fantasy for any of us, but collectively... That voice, that vision and that desire for change becomes much harder to ignore. This may seem a little irrelevant and slightly political, but Greece's transition from a Military dictatorship to a full democracy, was the end-result of voices of fewer people than the members of this forum being heard. If so few people could change the course of a nation, twice as many people can't change the course of a football program?!
  12. SO, no one here is suggesting that we should be on the board right off the bat, but are you suggesting that some type of representation of the fans on the board at some point is a bad idea or a hard sell? Furthermore, if I understand correctly, the CSA assmeblies are based on membership. Is it so out of whack to request/demand that some level of membership be allocated to the fans so that they have some type of voice off the field? Well, in a sold out game, that would entail some level of trust, but in a half empty stadium, where you're filling out 1/4 of the stadium, I think you're underestimating your achievements. And on that note, I have never sat in the Voyageurs sections, but have always admired it from afar and you guys and your passion is the reason many people show up to the games and sit in other sections and frankly, if it wasn't for you guys I wouldn't have brought a group of 30 people to the last game, none of whom had ever been to a CNMT game. Wihtout the excitement and real fan support, no one's going to come to the stadium and no one's going to watch the game on TV. Believe me when I say, that you guys are the inspiration behind the amazing fan support that the team received this time and if you don't believe me compare the number of fans in the stadium during those beautiful summer nights against the US or Cuba to the fans we had on the chilly October night against Honduras. Not all the fans may be Voyageurs or on this board, but they all have a little Voyageur in them. If you want that do die, like our hopes died with the Honduras game, then I guess we shouldn't do anything, but doing something isn't just for the people on this board - it's for all Canadian fans and all the players all over the country that come to the stadium and tune into the game to get a glimpse of the excitement the Voyageurs bring to the game.
  13. That's just it Obinna - under the current system, that document is as good as toilet paper, because the incentive is not there to implement it. I suppose under the current system, the CSA can offer coaches some type of financial incentive to follow its directives and implement it. But this is not a long term solution, I highly doubt the incentive will be something worthwhile and frankly if the coaches had the knowledge or ability to implement that, wouldn't they have done it already? So, the incentive has to be there for the teams, not for the coaches. As I said earlier, the only way in which you can create incentives in a sustainable manner and for the long term, is to have a proper multi-tiered national league with a promotion/relegation mechanism. Money is the biggest incentive for every team in every country with a proper football program - we're not the exception to the rules. Once the incentive is there for teams to invest, they will be the ones that implement LTPD's of their own, for financial gains, not because someone just wrote something on a piece of paper. And this is how you go about setting up that multi-tiered league... You entertain LOI's or bids from potential team owners. Let's say we want to set up a 4th division National League that feeds into the 3rd divsion National League and ultimately the National Premier League. You issue bonds with a maturity of 1 year and tell interested parties that they need to buy $100k of these bonds from the CSA (let's not get bogged down on legal hurdles if the CSA is a not-for-profit corporation) to own and manage their own 4th division teams. Every team that is in the 4th division at the end of the year receives $100k - in essence you get your money back after a year as a team owner if you fail. Every team that is promoted (based on however many spots) will receive $250k (I'm just using these numbers as an example btw). That $250k comes from the bonds that the 3rd division teams purchased at the beginning of the year. The overall total cost to CSA: Zero. The incentive for the 3rd division team to implement some type of LTPD is $150k, because they would undoubtedly set-up youth teams, B teams, etc. and would ultimately want to develop better players to get even higher returns on their original investment by moving into higher tiered leagues and ultimately have a share of the hige marketing and broadcast rights in the Premier League. Now, tell me there aren't 10 individuals in all of Canada who are willing to do this and start from a 4th division under such a system. And of course they're going to hire a semi-full time coach and offer their players $2000 bonuses to make it into the higher tiered leagues and implement some sort of LTPD - it's a hell of a return on your investment.
  14. Wish I could say the same thing about Victor!!! Respect to Hart for doing the right thing. To go from coaching the King of Donair to getting us within one game of the HEX for the 1st time in 16 years just goes to show how dedicated this man was to better himself and the tremendous potential that lurks below the surface in Canadian soccer. I am absolutely saddened by the way this chapter of his career had to end and the system that set up such a humiliating end. I think he will have a great future as one of the few pioneering coaches of a Canadian Premier League, if and when we finally get that launched and until more experienced and recognized coaches start to trickle in.
  15. Wow, it's good that it happened albeit in the wrong location! Yeah, I found out about it through the CSA's mailing list. Because I invested over $1,500 on group tickets, they finally put me on their mailing list! This is what I got from them a couple of days before the game (#2 & #3 never happened and #1 obviously happened at the exact opposite end of the stadium). But hey, half out of 3 is better than the 0 out of 3 they used to do! lol Dear Canadian Soccer Supporters, On behalf of the Canadian Soccer Association and the Men’s National Team we wish to thank you for your support of Canadian Soccer by organizing a group to attend tomorrow night’s Canada vs Panama 2014 FIFA World Cup Brazil™ Qualifying match at BMO Field. Friday’s match promises to be a historic night for Canada’s National Teams program. There are a number of special activities planned for the evening. Celebrate Canada’s Olympic Bronze Medal winning Women’s National Team Members of Canada’s bronze-medal winning Women’s National Team will be recognised during a special ceremony at the Canada vs. Panama match. Fan’s will have a chance to meet Canada’s Olympic heroes as members of the team will be signing autographs inside the stadium from 6pm – 7pm (enter through Gate 1). The pre-match ceremony will begin at 7:30pm so be sure to arrive early for what promises to be an emotional moment. PAINT BMO FIELD RED This is a crucial game for Canada on their road to Brazil! The Canadian squad is calling on all Canadian fans to show their true patriot love for this all-important FIFA World Cup Qualifying match by wearing red. Canadian Soccer Association Corporate Sponsors are supporting this effort with Canon Canada distributing small red flags to the first 5,000 fans entering the stadium and State Farm selecting special sections to receive 'Go Canada Go' cheer cards. PRE-MATCH FAN FEST Fans are encouraged to arrive early to BMO Field for a special pre-match Fan Fest outside of Gate 1. Running from 6pm until kick off and featuring interactive soccer activities from the Canadian Soccer Associations Corporate Partners.
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