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Why a fully open ... Voyageurs Cup is needed to grow the game...

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On 7/6/2018 at 2:04 AM, shamrock said:

My two cents:

1. Go to single elimination, saves time and causes more upsets, similar to European Cup set-up

2. MLS teams equal to Can PL teams. You can't say we're tier 1 and then give the upside to MLS teams

3. Only winners of QPLS / L1 qualify. It would get too big if other provinces start their D3 leagues plus it's supposed to be a price. So not all of the teams will have a shot. 

I would rather see as many teams as possible in the Canadian Championship. If you look at England they have all 6 levels plus non-league teams that compete for the FA cup would be fitting to have all teams in any division also have a shot here in Canada, but that’s just my opinion.

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We definitely need to expand this tournament ASAP.. you know it's bad when even die hards are starting to get bored.  The previous 2 seasons featured some crazy finishes and 2015 was the Whitecaps breakthrough but this year really showed that the tournament needs to grow.  The early rounds are the best part!

Early on it would be great to have teams qualify by region similar to the USA so that we can have Hamilton, York 9 and TFC play some L1O teams and then each other.  Similarly have Halifax, Ottawa and Montreal play some local champs... Winnipeg, Edmonton, Calgary and Victoria, Vancouver.  

When you do it this way over time it will probably become cheap but for now at least it's a good way to get things rolling.  Cheap costs for smaller clubs and the inevitable path that leads to derbies between CPL clubs and their local MLS team. So you either get a major upset or a CPL/MLS derby.  

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1 minute ago, Keegan said:

We definitely need to expand this tournament ASAP.. you know it's bad when even die hards are starting to get bored.  The previous 2 seasons featured some crazy finishes and 2015 was the Whitecaps breakthrough but this year really showed that the tournament needs to grow.  The early rounds are the best part!

Early on it would be great to have teams qualify by region similar to the USA so that we can have Hamilton, York 9 and TFC play some L1O teams and then each other.  Similarly have Halifax, Ottawa and Montreal play some local champs... Winnipeg, Edmonton, Calgary and Victoria, Vancouver.  

When you do it this way over time it will probably become cheap but for now at least it's a good way to get things rolling.  Cheap costs for smaller clubs and the inevitable path that leads to derbies between CPL clubs and their local MLS team. So you either get a major upset or a CPL/MLS derby.  

Totally agree wish they would consider doing this!

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On 8/16/2018 at 12:17 AM, Keegan said:

We definitely need to expand this tournament ASAP.. you know it's bad when even die hards are starting to get bored.  The previous 2 seasons featured some crazy finishes and 2015 was the Whitecaps breakthrough but this year really showed that the tournament needs to grow.  The early rounds are the best part!

Early on it would be great to have teams qualify by region similar to the USA so that we can have Hamilton, York 9 and TFC play some L1O teams and then each other.  Similarly have Halifax, Ottawa and Montreal play some local champs... Winnipeg, Edmonton, Calgary and Victoria, Vancouver.  

When you do it this way over time it will probably become cheap but for now at least it's a good way to get things rolling.  Cheap costs for smaller clubs and the inevitable path that leads to derbies between CPL clubs and their local MLS team. So you either get a major upset or a CPL/MLS derby.  

I would begrudgingly accept regional match ups in the earlier rounds because of cost savings, but it just makes the earlier rounds suffer from the problem that the tournament has right now. Oh look, another Pacific vs Whitecaps game, every year. Some teams would be handicapped by having to play the same teams (like the MLS teams) every year before they can get deep into the tournament. So yeah, my preference is still a straight up draw, but I realize that is unlikely to happen or even be feasible.

That being said, this tournament is still I think the most important competition any Canadian team plays in (maybe not for that particular team, but for soccer in Canada). I'd love to see the day when this tournament is a cash cow that can go a long way to help support a more expansive 3rd (and 2nd?) tier.

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This was the most expansive VC yet and interest seemed at an all-time low. Maybe the CPL will change things but TFC fans seem minimally interested in seeing Ottawa right now, I doubt that will change just because they are in their third league in five years.

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Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, Kent said:

I would begrudgingly accept regional match ups in the earlier rounds because of cost savings, but it just makes the earlier rounds suffer from the problem that the tournament has right now. Oh look, another Pacific vs Whitecaps game, every year. Some teams would be handicapped by having to play the same teams (like the MLS teams) every year before they can get deep into the tournament. So yeah, my preference is still a straight up draw, but I realize that is unlikely to happen or even be feasible.

That being said, this tournament is still I think the most important competition any Canadian team plays in (maybe not for that particular team, but for soccer in Canada). I'd love to see the day when this tournament is a cash cow that can go a long way to help support a more expansive 3rd (and 2nd?) tier.

These regional early rounds are done in Spain too, and the interest is low for the stronger teams. In fact, Barcelona uses one early round against a lesser opponent and asks season ticket holders to cede seats, and they go out and find a few hundred non-profit organizations and kids hospitals, all you could imagine, and they put 40,000 people who would otherwise never get to a game in the stands. Because otherwise, who wants to see a lesser club you have already got a solid result against in the first leg?

Not saying, however, that Ottawa would really be what we are talking about, that is not fair. 

If we'd get the MLS clubs at least in quarters, as soon as we see any side being knocked out by a CPL team or even a lower level, we have a story line that is worth talking about, and the Cup gains prestige.

Another factor that could really help, thinking about the FA cup: late round games on key weekend dates. Would make a big difference.

Edited by Unnamed Trialist

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3 hours ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

These regional early rounds are done in Spain too, and the interest is low for the stronger teams. In fact, Barcelona uses one early round against a lesser opponent and asks season ticket holders to cede seats, and they go out and find a few hundred non-profit organizations and kids hospitals, all you could imagine, and they put 40,000 people who would otherwise never get to a game in the stands. Because otherwise, who wants to see a lesser club you have already got a solid result against in the first leg?

Not saying, however, that Ottawa would really be what we are talking about, that is not fair. 

If we'd get the MLS clubs at least in quarters, as soon as we see any side being knocked out by a CPL team or even a lower level, we have a story line that is worth talking about, and the Cup gains prestige.

Another factor that could really help, thinking about the FA cup: late round games on key weekend dates. Would make a big difference.

Would love to see this just so MLS loses their minds.

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4 hours ago, Dub Narcotic said:

This was the most expansive VC yet and interest seemed at an all-time low. Maybe the CPL will change things but TFC fans seem minimally interested in seeing Ottawa right now, I doubt that will change just because they are in their third league in five years.

Well that’s not surprising nothing changed whatsoever for the fans.  Hamilton/York v Toronto would be a whole different ball game.. and maybe it will get old but at the same time don’t we want a derby at least once a year?

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2 hours ago, Keegan said:

Would love to see this just so MLS loses their minds.

Late round weekend matches for VC wouldn't bother MLS clubs at all. The dates would be known before league and CCL schedules are released so it would have no effect.

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9 hours ago, Keegan said:

Well that’s not surprising nothing changed whatsoever for the fans.  Hamilton/York v Toronto would be a whole different ball game.. and maybe it will get old but at the same time don’t we want a derby at least once a year?

Think a lot depends on how competitive the games are. If MLS teams are routinely rattling 4 or more past CanPL teams, crowds might be very low, unfortunately. All the empty seats for the second leg against the Whitecaps at BMO Field is already alarming to see as it shows yet again how the Canadian angle whether it be the national team or domestic pro competition doesn't excite fans the way it should.

There would need to be regular upsets for interest to grow organically from where it is at right now and I'm not sure how likely that is if salary caps are below $1 million, because the Canadian MLS teams have been taking entry into CONCACAF competition very seriously so it won't be like the League Cup in England where the top teams use it to give playing time to fringe players. Time will tell obviously.

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13 hours ago, Prune_55 said:

Late round weekend matches for VC wouldn't bother MLS clubs at all. The dates would be known before league and CCL schedules are released so it would have no effect.

That narrative, though.

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