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HFX Wanderers launch/2019 offseason thread

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The entire deal for merchandising for this league is very small, has to be said. It is not a lucrative deal for any clothing manufacturer, and they are not going to pay very much to have the deal, don' think. 

It is good for clubs to sell before a deal is made for the entire league, as I see it, for two key reasons. First, it enables them to gauge interest in merchandise, even collect stats. Second, it responds to demand related to an early bird ticket sales push, and to not do that is counterproductive, it is a waste of momentum.  IN contrast, if people are wearing an HFX shirt to work or school, that gets people asking questions, so that it works to assist in the ticket sales campaign.

Related to this, I have never been sure that a single deal is the best thing. MLS has an Adidas deal, but that kills off the competition and means no club really is getting an advantage by doing their own thing. I like that each club, so far, has done their own marketing. I would like to see some basic standard, like the CPL logo on everything, however small, but beyond that a deal per club and manufacturer would really lets each club have control. When you get a single sponsor, they can tend to cookie cut, they unify to simplify, and they may or may not properly serve a market.

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Posted (edited)
51 minutes ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

The entire deal for merchandising for this league is very small, has to be said. It is not a lucrative deal for any clothing manufacturer, and they are not going to pay very much to have the deal, don' think. 

Who is talking about them paying much? I'm talking about them not actually being interested in that part of the league. While small it's still NLL numbers for attendances as the projection (from league figures themselves) and NLL has deals in place with Warrior and Under Amour for merch so there clearly is an interest in leagues of this size. Given NLL is 30~ years old but the CPL is coming in with some big players in the Canadian sports world and that should account for something.

51 minutes ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

It is good for clubs to sell before a deal is made for the entire league, as I see it, for two key reasons. First, it enables them to gauge interest in merchandise, even collect stats. Second, it responds to demand related to an early bird ticket sales push, and to not do that is counterproductive, it is a waste of momentum.  IN contrast, if people are wearing an HFX shirt to work or school, that gets people asking questions, so that it works to assist in the ticket sales campaign.

This one is a little more messy because I do agree with much of what you're saying but question if selling t-shirts is the best way to figure out who is actually interested over cheaper and safer routes. I also don't think it's the best promotion at this stage (especially if they gave a ton of launch merch away for free already).

51 minutes ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

Related to this, I have never been sure that a single deal is the best thing. MLS has an Adidas deal, but that kills off the competition and means no club really is getting an advantage by doing their own thing. I like that each club, so far, has done their own marketing. I would like to see some basic standard, like the CPL logo on everything, however small, but beyond that a deal per club and manufacturer would really lets each club have control. When you get a single sponsor, they can tend to cookie cut, they unify to simplify, and they may or may not properly serve a market.

I'm against the single deal as well. I want the league to look cool and what better way than pitting Nike and New Balance and Umbro against each other to be Narcity's raddest CPL jersey. People like cool jersey and MLS kits are not cool.

The big advantage I see in a single maker is maybe a bigger retail market and exposure.

Edited by matty

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Posted (edited)

You’re thinking too much matty.. they’re selling shirts, it’s positive and the big wigs don’t care I promise you. I don’t see how it could be negative at all, it’s all good.. Gildan or not get the team out there.  All leagues were at this stage at some point.. no need to worry, increase brand awareness = increased value.

You have to look at the bigger picture, we are a sports league not a merchandiser at this point.  People who are buying things are buying them because they’re fans.. if the gear isn’t hip enough to be worn as fashion just yet we’re not worried because we’re selling a league and brand and not fashion just yet.

Edited by Keegan

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11 hours ago, matty said:

I'm against the single deal as well. I want the league to look cool and what better way than pitting Nike and New Balance and Umbro against each other to be Narcity's raddest CPL jersey. People like cool jersey and MLS kits are not cool.

The big advantage I see in a single maker is maybe a bigger retail market and exposure.

I like how you describe it. As long as you have a bit of league vetting or control, as you never know when a FO has their designer lobes up their butts, having a very unique bunch of shirts would be great. That is why I think you have to have a bit of central control in terms of contrasting colours, designing the home and aways, thinking about being unique: then maybe let each club find a manufacturer to market as they see fit. 

But I suppose they'll find that too complicated and go for a unique sponsor and unified criteria through the designers sitting in some office in Germany or Portland.

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Posted (edited)

The league/fan base isn't big enough to go with separate providers for each team. I have talked with people and FC Edmonton and with the league. The league is looking at a league wide provider because it will make more money. Think about it, is a large company like Nike really going to be shelling out money to reach the small market in Halifax? As well, each team would have to spend time and money finding a provider and searching for one. With a league wide provider it will be easier to negotiate a large deal, and it only needs to be done once. Not by every team.

Maybe down the road when there is established success and a bigger fan base it will be beneficial to do separate providers, but right now it would be to difficult and costly.

It is things like this that sunk FC Edmonton. They had to do all the work themselves with no support from the league. League wide sponsors offer more money with less expenses to acquire them.

Edited by BenFisk'sBiggestFan

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10 hours ago, Keegan said:

You’re thinking too much matty.. they’re selling shirts, it’s positive and the big wigs don’t care I promise you. I don’t see how it could be negative at all, it’s all good.. Gildan or not get the team out there.  All leagues were at this stage at some point.. no need to worry, increase brand awareness = increased value.

No I think I've just thought a little and think this is a weird move and it's cool if you don't but I do.

10 hours ago, Keegan said:

You have to look at the bigger picture, we are a sports league not a merchandiser at this point.  People who are buying things are buying them because they’re fans.. if the gear isn’t hip enough to be worn as fashion just yet we’re not worried because we’re selling a league and brand and not fashion just yet.

I am looking at the bigger picture and sports leagues and teams are about merch as much as they are about sport in the modern age and if you disagree that's fine but I do suggest you check it out. There's a reason why you can buy pink jerseys and minimalist t-shirts and it's because some fans do give a shit about what they wear even if they love the team (soccer kind of proves that). The fact the CPL felt the need to put out merch at this stage kind of proves they are very much about merch.

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I've been under the impression that the Atlantic Selects U23 were playing the Fortuna Dusseldorf U23 squad on July 28, but the U23 side has a league match listed on their website against SV Lippstadt 08 the same day (https://www.f95.de/nachwuchs/u23/spielplan/) and the first team has a friendly on July 18, then nothing until August 14 (https://www.f95.de/profis/testspiele/20182019/). Perhaps Fortuna Dusseldorf is sending the first team. Anyone more knowledgeable around this match or Fortuna Dusseldorf have some insight? 

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Posted (edited)

Although innovative shirt designs would be appealing, I do think there's merit to the idea of having 1 league-wide kit supplier as I expect it would indeed help keep costs down. I recall a post from another thread where someone quoted a former NASL exec who mentioned that one of the reasons that league failed was that they did not bother to centralize certain costs. 

Edited by Kurt-MTL

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1 hour ago, HfxCeltic said:

I've been under the impression that the Atlantic Selects U23 were playing the Fortuna Dusseldorf U23 squad on July 28, but the U23 side has a league match listed on their website against SV Lippstadt 08 the same day (https://www.f95.de/nachwuchs/u23/spielplan/) and the first team has a friendly on July 18, then nothing until August 14 (https://www.f95.de/profis/testspiele/20182019/). Perhaps Fortuna Dusseldorf is sending the first team. Anyone more knowledgeable around this match or Fortuna Dusseldorf have some insight? 

Some Fortuna fans mentioned this the other day on Twitter. They said the first team will be in Austria for a training camp until the day before, so it's unlikely to be them. Sounds like it would have to be the U19s. But they also thought the pricing for it to be U23s was a "scam"

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Posted (edited)
35 minutes ago, TheCanPLHub said:

Some Fortuna fans mentioned this the other day on Twitter. They said the first team will be in Austria for a training camp until the day before, so it's unlikely to be them. Sounds like it would have to be the U19s. But they also thought the pricing for it to be U23s was a "scam"

Well that's certainly disappointing. I realize having a bunch of Atlantic Selects vs  a German Bundesliga side would have been a shit kicking, but the general message from SEA has been "Fortuna Dusseldorf - German Bundesliga Div I vs HFX Wanderers Atlantic Selects". Either they're being purposefully deceitful to encourage ticket sales, or they have no clue there is a difference between the first team (bundesliga), U23 side (regionillia west), and U19 - I don't know which is more troubling. Prices are certainly too steep to watch a U19 vs U23 amateur match.

Edit - just heard mostly U20s with a few U23s sprinkled in - perhaps Kianz Froese? I already bought tickets, so am pretty much blowing hot air.

Edited by HfxCeltic

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1 minute ago, HfxCeltic said:

Well that's certainly disappointing. I realize having a bunch of Atlantic Selects vs  a German Bundesliga side would have been a shit kicking, but the general message from SEA has been "Fortuna Dusseldorf - German Bundesliga Div I vs HFX Wanderers Atlantic Selects". Either they're being purposefully deceitful to encourage ticket sales, or they have no clue there is a difference between the first team (bundesliga), U23 side (regionillia west), and U19 - I don't know which is more troubling. Prices are certainly too steep to watch a U19 vs U23 amateur match.

Went back through their tweets to see if it gave any more information and saw this. Given they don't have an U20 team, I'm expecting a mixture of their U19 squad and U23 players who won't make the team for their league match.

A bit of a shame things couldn't be made clearer, hopefully the first 'real' friendlies go down better.

 

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16 hours ago, HfxCeltic said:

Well that's certainly disappointing. I realize having a bunch of Atlantic Selects vs  a German Bundesliga side would have been a shit kicking, but the general message from SEA has been "Fortuna Dusseldorf - German Bundesliga Div I vs HFX Wanderers Atlantic Selects". Either they're being purposefully deceitful to encourage ticket sales, or they have no clue there is a difference between the first team (bundesliga), U23 side (regionillia west), and U19 - I don't know which is more troubling. Prices are certainly too steep to watch a U19 vs U23 amateur match.

Edit - just heard mostly U20s with a few U23s sprinkled in - perhaps Kianz Froese? I already bought tickets, so am pretty much blowing hot air.

I feel largely the same way. My feeling is you only have one chance to make a fist impression and this is not exactly a great one. 

I also purchased a ticket behind the goal for $25.50 but I do know some people who wanted to attend and bring some people who are not going to go because they feel the prices are crazy. Many of the tickets in the main grand stand are $43.50 and I already have people (some casual sports fans and some not really big sports fans just like to get out to a few games) saying to me 'they not really going to be charging 45$ to go to a game when the local team starts are they'?

The Atlantic team is made up of players mostly from players in the local men's senior league and some university guys. Normally they command a 5$ admission fee for game in their leagues. No one really knows who is coming from Germany - im not even sure if the local ownership group even knows who will show up but that fact that a lot of the promotional is promoting a German Division one team is a little misleading I feel.

Is roughly the equivalent in my eyes of advertising TFC of the MLS is coming to town then sending a bunch of players from TFC 3 with a couple TFC 2 player sprinkled in.

So many aspects of this just don't feel right. Maybe im reading too much into it but I really would like the team and league to do well and flourish. However this seems like a rather mediocre first impression

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21 hours ago, Ansem said:

 

I wonder how much scouting, if any, will he do in Newfoundland. I can think of a few players from the provincial Challenge cup league that may warrent a look.

One is Tyler Forsey, I believe that's his name. Otherwise goes by the name fish. One of the better attackers I have played against in that league. Read a few years ago online that he had a trial in Germany with a 2.Bundesliga club, can't recall if it was Energie Cottbus or Dynamo Dresden, but confident it was one of those two. From what I recall, it was with their youth team and he didn't make the cut, but the fact he got the trial says something. Fish apparently also played in New Brunswick with a PDL team a few years ago, can't recall the name. I think he plays for MUN as well and I believe he is still youngish, 25 maybe? Anyhow, I would think that's the sort of player Hart will be looking at to fill out his roster - talented amateurs who can likely be signed for cheap.

Another one who I have not played against, but have seen clips of, is Emmanuel Dolo. His story is similar to Davies in that he originates from West Africa (Liberia, I think) but moved to Newfoundland as a young kid. One of the guys I know from back home who is heavily involved with coaching back home mentioned years ago that he has pro potential and many years later perhaps he can get his chance with Halifax. I have followed with interest as he seems to be the best chance of Newfoundland developing a pro player. He's been a part of the U15 Canada ID camps. He's spent time in the Ottawa Fury set up, I believe, before they disbanded their academy. He has scored a lot of goals at club nationals too and is currently playing in the NL Challenge Cup league and is scoring from what I can see. He's 18 or 19 I think, so he's young enough to embark on a full pro career. I am sure he is on Hart's radar and I really hope he can make it.

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Posted (edited)
11 minutes ago, DigzTFC said:

image.thumb.png.bd15a79970b963fddafc83031107563f.png

Great find, thanks! Glad to see Dolo get the invite. A little surprised to see Michael O'brien from Mount Perarl. Name doesn't ring a bell so perhaps I have been away for too long. 

Another name I recognize is Jonathan Cordoba. I played with a guy who played with him in NS. Suppose to be a good player and I believe he is from Venezuela or Colombia originally, can't recall which one. Attacking player.

Then the other name I recognize is Derek Gaudet. He played briefly with TFC.

Anyways, really looking forward to see how these guys do in this friendly against Dusselfdorf.

Edited by Obinna

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Paul Craig used to play for FC Edmonton and Derek Guadet played for TFC and Portland Timbers U23. Both players are on the senior side of U23. Googled Jacob Shaffelburg last night when the list came in and he looks quite good - he's the kid on the match poster. Guess he played prep school in the states (same school as Jack Harrison) and has committed to the University of Virginia. Here's an article and highlight video - https://www.brotherlygame.com/2017/3/17/14957746/academy-newcomer-jacob-shaffelburg-makes-debut-in-bethlehem-steel-friendly - either incredibly speedy or played against a bunch of turtles.

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7 hours ago, grasshopper1917 said:

I feel largely the same way. My feeling is you only have one chance to make a fist impression and this is not exactly a great one. 

I also purchased a ticket behind the goal for $25.50 but I do know some people who wanted to attend and bring some people who are not going to go because they feel the prices are crazy. Many of the tickets in the main grand stand are $43.50 and I already have people (some casual sports fans and some not really big sports fans just like to get out to a few games) saying to me 'they not really going to be charging 45$ to go to a game when the local team starts are they'?

The Atlantic team is made up of players mostly from players in the local men's senior league and some university guys. Normally they command a 5$ admission fee for game in their leagues. No one really knows who is coming from Germany - im not even sure if the local ownership group even knows who will show up but that fact that a lot of the promotional is promoting a German Division one team is a little misleading I feel.

Is roughly the equivalent in my eyes of advertising TFC of the MLS is coming to town then sending a bunch of players from TFC 3 with a couple TFC 2 player sprinkled in.

So many aspects of this just don't feel right. Maybe im reading too much into it but I really would like the team and league to do well and flourish. However this seems like a rather mediocre first impression

Thing is, looking at a few of the USL teams, these prices seem to be in line with them (if it's the range the Wanderers are looking at for their ticket pricing as well).  If people are balking at the price for this game, that's maybe fine.  But if there's already concern about this being "too much" for the CPL, that's....maybe not as good.

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It costs money to stage these events. Paying $5 to watch a NSSL game has no relation to a friendly with a European team (albeit a youth team).

Maritimers can be pretty cheap people (I was born and raised in Halifax, I know). I hope the locals understand the economics.

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8 hours ago, HfxCeltic said:

Paul Craig used to play for FC Edmonton and Derek Guadet played for TFC and Portland Timbers U23. Both players are on the senior side of U23. Googled Jacob Shaffelburg last night when the list came in and he looks quite good - he's the kid on the match poster. Guess he played prep school in the states (same school as Jack Harrison) and has committed to the University of Virginia. Here's an article and highlight video - https://www.brotherlygame.com/2017/3/17/14957746/academy-newcomer-jacob-shaffelburg-makes-debut-in-bethlehem-steel-friendly - either incredibly speedy or played against a bunch of turtles.

Thanks for the link. Only watched a few minutes but found it trippy seeing some teams without numbers on their shirts. I hope those are some sort of preseason games.

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47 minutes ago, Soccerpro said:

It costs money to stage these events. Paying $5 to watch a NSSL game has no relation to a friendly with a European team (albeit a youth team).

Maritimers can be pretty cheap people (I was born and raised in Halifax, I know). I hope the locals understand the economics.

I agree that these things cost money to stage. I wasn't suggesting that the tickets be 5$ however I feel $43.50 i'snt the right price point either. Sure it costs money to bring some German players in and host them and I think Nova Scotian's also get this. However I don't think suggesting that the price may a little high for a friendly between a local senior/university all star team VS what appears to be a German C side means people are 'cheap'. (Even though I readily admit I personally am   lol) 

Im sorry but I find your statement 'I hope locals understand the economics' a little off. I think Maritimer's are bright people. However I think it is important that the league and ownership understand the economics of Halifax. The economy is simply not great here. There are too many hard working and bright people scraping by on low paying jobs or multiple part time jobs due to the lack of quality employment and decently priced rental housing. 

Simply put 45$ to a family in Halifax may not be the same as 45$ in other markets where there are stronger economies. I disagree that Maritimers are inherently cheap - I think the more accurate reality is simply more of us have less money left over after paying bills and have to think more about how we spend out entertainment dollar.

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